 November 19, 2007 - 7:48pm | I have always preferred a simple campaign... So I enjoy the simplicity of the Sathar and their pure evil. I don't have Zebulon's, but I have read it. I like the new equipment and skills, but I am not too hot on the new races and certainly DO NOT like the way that the Second Sathar War came out, so I have taken a somewhat different path. Anyway - some thoughts about the Sathar. After the capture of the obsolescent Assault Carrier by heroic Boarding Party actions of a joint UPF/Clarion Militia operation, research has revealed some fascinating details of the Frontier's great nemesis: The Sathar. The Sathar are an ancient race, somewhat older even than the Yazirians. There was no contact with anyone, no Cliks or Klooks or anything else. Their history, much like Earth's, has been one of extreme violence. However, tragically, any Sathar clans that renounced violence or anything other than development of the Universal Empire were annhilliated by the clans which now rule it. The remnants of these ancestors are mere lower caste slaves. The Empire is divided into three distinct castes: Upper 1% of the Sathar population are the ruling caste. They, linked now to a Supercomputer, make all of the decisions in the Empire. Their control is total - from the Middle Castes by will, and the Lower Castes by force. The key biological trait of Sathar are their vast reproductive rate: an average female can have 10 to 20 offspring. In the struggles for power through the centuries, the Sathar have become thoroughly brutalized, and life means very, very little to them. Alien life means absolutely nothing to them (more on this later). To maintain their grasp on power, the Upper Caste grants great privileges and opportunities for the Middle Caste Sathar, which are about 9% - 15% of the population, as determined by the Upper Castes and the SuperComputer. The vagaries of disease and battle necessitate a flexibility towards the maintenance of a solid Middle Caste. Middle Caste Sathar perform all technical duties in the Empire. All of the scientists, administrators, military officers, and ship crews are populated by Middle Caste Sathar. They are not subjected to the same amount of mental and chemical interference as the Lower Caste Sathar. Plus, they are driven through centuries of conditioning that their place in the Empire is vital and they must perform it until death. Lower Caste Sathar are a sad bunch. They are the vast majority of the 30 Billion Sathar population. Everything is strictly controlled by the Upper and Middle Castes. Reproduction is closely monitored, with all Lower Caste newborns taken for "Processing" at the numerous Processing Centers around the Empire. Not all newborns survive. All never see their parents again. From evidence gathered in the historical archives in the captured Sathar computer, all manual labor tasks are handled by these slave-Sathar. They come out of the Processing Centers totally brain-washed. This then gets reinforced by culture, brutalization, propaganda, subliminal messages, and drugs. Newly processed Lower Caste Sathar are delivered into Labor Units. Raw labor backs up machines and robots to construct and maintain the infrastructure necessary to create and maintain an interstellar Empire. Some Labor Units are taught simple skills with certain machinery. Many millions are drafted into the Army, to be used in wave attacks. They are given laser rifles, a clip or two, and are sent charging into battle. Lower Caste foot soldiers are totally expendable. Their Middle Caste officers attack accordingly. Lower Caste Sathar are little better than cattle. Their slaughter is sometimes regarded by the Upper Castes and the Supercomputer as positive population control! The only thing lower than a Lower Caste Sathar is an alien. All aliens are viewed in one of two ways - either they are primitive, and thus will be used as slaves, or they are advanced, and must be killed. There is no negotiation. Slaves are taken and put into the most dangerous work - usually the mining of radioactive materials. Others grow the insects that the Sathar use as food on huge biofarms. Leadership, soldiers, scientists, and anyone else in the captured society that might be a threat are all killed. In their explorations, the Sathar have only encountered the Frontier as a society with improved technology to their own, and only slightly. Plus, the Sathar have superior Astrogational ability, as they have been able to mask their comings and goings through the Void to attack UPF planets. They feel that the Frontier is just an obstacle to their continued expansion. Hydrogen and Neutron bombs are all that await for the Federation Planets. H-bombs on cities, and Neutron bombs near valuable resources so they can be later exploited. That is the model from the First Sathar War and Sathar goals in terms of the Frontier remain the same. Total destruction. The Sathar worship a war god which is used to give the Middle Caste and Upper Caste Sathar a sense of purpose. The war god also is used to convey messages to the Lower Caste, who are so brain washed and drugged out that they completely obey, believing that their great God is commanding them. The message of their God is very simple - Conquer the Universe! The Clan X and Clan Y rivalry is very real. In the old days, these two super-clans were the two coalitions that came out on top of the centuries of warfare on the Sathar home planet. With the help of the Supercomputer, these two senior clans developed a universal Empire to govern their race, with a negotiated power-sharing agreement. The Supercomputer was constructed by both Sathar clans to help negotiate the final power-sharing agreement. This enlightened moment allowed a settlement of the Great Wars. The Upper Castes of Clan X and Y then put in place their system for collective scientific, industrial, and military power. Upper Castes Command (aided by the SuperComputer, not influenced by Clan loyalties or rivalries). Middle Castes execute the commands of the Upper Caste. Lower Caste Sathar obey. My campaign takes place between the two wars, so that lets us dodge a lot of the weird stuff in Zeb's. Four PC races is enough for me. Plus I like to throw in the Memhne (sp?) and the Eorna because those guys are pretty cool - but only as NPC races. I think this Sathar template is a decent base upon which to build, and I can always have various UPF research "breakthroughs" reveal information about the Sathar as I figure it all out. My dream is to have some sort of Final Campaign that includes the invasion and destruction of the Sathar Empire... |
 April 29, 2009 - 12:05pm | No apology necessary, I just thought you were Rum'd up. ;-) Imperial said what I wanted to say. If I was Imperial I would have said it. But seeing that I'm not Imperial I didn't say it. Imperial is not me. Imperial is all that glitters 'round these here parts! |
 April 30, 2009 - 12:29pm | I hate the idea of the Sessu... Not to mention the fact that they are cheating evil schemers. Actually they remind me of the original concept of the Ferengi before it was decided that the Ferengi weren't gonna cut it as a bad enemy and they became comic relief. (frankly TNG would have sucked without the Borg)! Now taking from IL's ideas I like the Sessu as a nearly wiped out clan that did the BSG thing with a rag tag fleet fleeing for a new home world. where their incredible reproductive fertility kicked in and let them recover but being cut off from the rest of the sathar empire and the all controlling computer their society has undergone some evolution. They would love nothing more then to knock off the leadership of Clan X and Y and take over the whole shebang! To that end they have info that they could and may sell to the UPF to facilitate a final campaign to destroy the sathar BUT they need to control how that is done so that they can back stab the UPF and take over at the crucial moment. A fragmentation of the sathar empire could lead to lots of confussion and even a developement of the reaver sathar in much the same way the firefly reaver originated. This would result with some Clan X or Y remenents and the new Sessu empire and some REaver sathar- the lethal evilness of the sathar empire is kind of blunted but some of the scattered remnents are even more dangerous ie the Reaver-thar. maybe the UPF ends up with a few territories that they have to administer because of the primitive slave races there plus the 1000's of attack monster running loose. The Sessu would allow the UPF to have these territories while they consolidate power but eventually they'll want to take them back, leading to conflict. EDIT PS: I would run the Beyond the Frontier campaign from KHs and with a successfull running of that information developes concerning Clan Y spying ( they were spying on clan X in those modules) on the Sessu and leads the UPF to investigate the Sessu systems and make contact. The Sessu being evil schemers immediately see an opportunity to get even with the X Y sathar they offer to provide the astro data on sathar home territory and bring their fleet, which is equall to the UPF fleet in a joint venture to wipe out the sathar. And so begins Satharmeggedon or Sessu Dawn.... I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
May 1, 2009 - 8:42am | Reasonable, Jedion... I like it! I have to tip my hat off to you - I guess there IS a situation where the Sessneu could be appropriate to a campaign. However, even in your example, great as it is, the Sessneu would really only be NPCs. Again, I still think it is difficult to fit the Sessneu in there. But of all the possiblities, I see your explanation and fit into the campaign as the best. In all honesty, I had immediately rejected and dismissed the Sessneu, so I had not put any thought into them. That being said, you can have a campaign as you described without the Sessneu as well. |
 June 12, 2009 - 9:59pm | For some reason I couldn't find this discussion again until now. The following rant is stated only out of irritation, not pissed off or anything. So only read it as someone who simply disagrees with the course taken. I would entertain a suggestion for almost any race, but such a being should be cool and reasonable, not crap from Zebs or some ill-considered mag. The issue of canon, so to speak, is almost irrelevant. That is your personal opinion dictating how your players should play the game, suggesting that their preferences are only given ear if it doesn't conflict with your personal prejudices. And "prejudice" is exactly the right word. If you were prejudiced against non-whites and didn't allow players to play someone not human and white because of your prejudice, the only room you are allowing for in the game is for other people with the same prejudice as yourself, because people without that prejudice are going to be too offended by your prejudice to want to play with you. You said you would "laugh them out of the game", showing no respect for them or their right to self expression. It's insulting behavior that should not be tolerated by anyone. Then you mocked and exaggerated the use of Sess'su with saying that by including one suddenly a whole slew of rainbow colored Sathar would then certainly be introduced, which isn't even remotely in the ballpark. Plenty of others have played with the Sess'su without introducing a "rainbow" of other Sathar, so your argument is about a quarter century out of date, having been proven wrong by time. But here someone offers a different view in which the rainbow is actually beginning to grow with "reaver" Sathar thrown in the mix and you're all gung-ho for it. So clearly the problem for you wasn't the color of the Sathar, but the fact that any could be considered good at all. Look, just because people don't like the fact that you railroad your players into a specific view of the Star Frontiers universe to the point that you would laugh a player out of your group for having an idea, doesn't mean you should try to smooth it over with insincere words. If that's who you are, which is clear, then man up to it. You got a vision, and people are not allowed to go outside of that vision in your games. Fine. But that should be an open and clearcut rule that your players should know. But if you try to cover it over with false claims that your game is somehow open to new ideas and then laugh people out of your games because they didn't know that your game follows only your rigid view of the game's universe, you're eventually going to end up sitting at your table alone when you've laughed everyone out of your group for trying to introduce their own ideas. "You want to play a Zeb's race? Hahaha...Get out." "You want to introduce an Alternity race? Hahaha...Get out." "You want to use a phaser weapon? Hahaha...Get out." "You want your character to have blue hair? Hahaha...Get out." "You want to use a Fighter? Hahaha...get out, Mom." So really, my objection here has more to do with your lack of owning up. If you had said, "yeah, I guess I am like that, but my players know that, because I have that rule," then what would I have anything more to object about? If your players know that before the game gets started, then they know what they're getting into and its their own fault when they get laughed out of the group. But if you continue to put on a false face about being open and accepting new ideas, then you're hurting everyone at your game table, including yourself. I can see 6 people sitting at a table if they know the GM is going to fit their game into a very narrow mold, but I can't see 2 people sitting at a game in which one of them thinks the other one is open to ideas when exactly the opposite is true. When I GM Star Wars, I fit the game into a cannon mold that excludes the Yuzhan Vong, and I will let the players know this from the beginning, but for Star Frontiers, a game of exploration that is nowhere near exhaustive or molded, there is near infinite room. When I play SF, I play it for exactly that reason, with only a few minor setting molds: the Sathar should always be a puzzle, unknown and unknowable. But the Sess'su are a way around that mold, which is great in my eyes. If a player sees a mold and develops a way around that mold, there is no reason in the universe to stop them, unless your general game rule is "my way or the highway," but at least they'll know what the rule is. But laughing them out for having an idea is beyond arrogant. View my profile for a list of articles I have written, am writing, will write. "It's yo' mama!" —Wicket W. Warrick, Star Wars Ep. VI: Return of the Jedi "That guy's wise." —Logray, Star Wars Ep.VI: Return of the Jedi Do You Wanna Date My Avatar? - Felicia Day (The Guild) |
June 13, 2009 - 7:43am | That being said, you can have a campaign as you described without the Sessneu as well. actually that campaign I described was essentially developed in my head without the seesue but after looking at your material and mixing in mine and stuff from the KH modules and adding the sessue it all works together into a campaign Idea with more depth and detail. Depth and detail are good things. But your right if you dont really like the sessue this works as well but I think there is greater scope for intrigue and puzzles with the sessue themselves being a puzzle. Why are they doing this? the PCs get saddled with a sessue laison officer and they're part of a task force with sessue ships- or the seesue are giving the PCs a ride into sathar territory since their ships look like sathar ships. on one mission the PCs and their laison officer are infiltrating or raiding a sathar installation and the laison officer does some odd actions that are part of an agenda that the PCs are not privy to but the PCs observe these actions. They cant just shoot him as he's officially on their side but over 3 missions/ sessions of play there will be numerous clues that their laison officer/ and or his race have a vastly different agenda going on under the surface while they officially are playing lip service to the official agenda. Utimately the combined Sessue and UPF fleet formalize a battle plan to tie up the sathar fleet while a special forces team penetrates to the Sathar home planet with battlefield tactical nukes and a mission to take out the overmind computer and disable the sathar ability to wage war. The PCs objective is to take out the overmind, while their sessue counter parts will take out the sathar equivelent of the pentagon with a similar nuke. The sessue team intend nothing of the sort they're just waiting for the PCs to take out the overmind then in the confussion they'll seize control of the clan x pentagon. By controlling the sathar version of the pentagon the sessue gain control of clan x's client species like the zuraquor- all other sathar warships devolve into totall confussion and will operate as per a set of rules causing them to move and shoot more or less randomly but to head for and attack any enemy within a certain number of hexes. This leaves them on the board and dangerous but avoidable and they never coordinate attacks. Previously, clan y's overmind had not been taken out but the clans ability to wage war was crippled: some of the objectives on that mission had not be achieved. The sessue were insistent they clan y were effectively crippled and could be mopped up at leizure and they pushed for this drive on clan x, the real sathar power base. At the moment that the sessue achieve control of clan x's client military units the sessue turn on the UPF units in a bid for total domination of this quadrant of space. shortly after a small fleet of clan y ships turn up who have allied with the sessue realizing that if they dont they're toast. and Admiral Custer on the UPF battleship Armstrong gets a big surprise as he tries to withdraw the remnants of his fleet in the face of 2:1 or 3:1 odds. it may even be that the best path to safety is to drive into the heart of the clan x ships hoping that they will equally attack the sessue and clan y ships. This will be a massive KH scenario: Phase 1: KH scenario involving drawing out the clan x ships so that PC can infiltrate on a sessue captured clan x ship. the objective is to not engage toe to toe but to draw the sathar out of possition. Phase 2: Is AD scenario where the PCs and sessue teams infiltrate and attempt to detonate their nukes. Phase 2.1 : Sessue betrayal! AD scenario but leaves the PCs in a cliff hanger situation. Phase 3: KH scenario: Armstrong's Last Stand UPF fleet (whatever remains after Phase 1's game) tries to escape the trap. they're out numbered by the sessue and their "turned" allies the zuraquor. and newly arrived clan y smallish but fresh fleet is closing in and the demoralized and confused remnants of clan x's fleet are on the other side. Can they escape and preserve as many fighting units as possible as the balance of power is obviously shifting? Phase 4: PC's what you gonna do now? Your fleet is destroyed or run away and your trapped on a sathar capitol planet in the middle of a sathar revolution/ civil war. Their sessue laison officer coms them to suggest they give up or kill themselves. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 13, 2009 - 12:46pm | Ascent - How about rather than "laughing them out of the campaign" replace that with "politely discuss how the choice of Sessnu is not feasible." Happy now? It would take an entire campaign to introduce the Sessnu in Star Frontiers. As I said before - they look just like Sathar, but are a different color. This is pretty cheesy right there. Reminds me of Diablo with all the different colors of monsters, but with the same sprites. As I said earlier, it would take a lot of explaining. A Sessnu PC would face myriad challenges. First, he (or she?) would have to convince everyone in the Frontier that he is not a threat. What if he is dressed in a enviro or space suit?! He would look a lot like a Sathar, right? Would he carry around a neon sign like some rapper in the 'hood that he is a Sessnu and not the blood enemy of the Frontier? What would stop him from being shot on sight? The continous role play would get tedious. Time and again, a ref would have to work in various confrontations in which the Sessnu and the party (ostensibly) has to convince people in Federation backwaters who are not aware of the Sessnu. Then the real tediousness begins. Now the Sessnu PC would have to engage in ruthless business practices, etc. and try to rip people off. Of course, the PC might choose to play a less con-man Sessnu, but how would NPCs, who were exposed to Sessnu and know not to kill them, react to this "kinder, gentler" Sessnu? It just seems like a nightmare to me. Again, if you really really want to have Sessnu PCs, then fine, I won't stop you. I would be happy to read your modules and accounts of your campaigns. I don't just jump out and make harsh judgements like these. As you can see from the paragraphs above, I thought a lot about the Sessnu. But to maintain some sense of reality, there are many issues with their introduction, particularly as PCs. If you can get around all of these difficulties, then great. But my preference is not to have to deal with them rather than altering huge portions of my modules, out of sheer realistic necessity. |
 October 18, 2009 - 3:46am | Must admit that it is interesting to see where this thread has gone since I was last in here! ;) I agree with IL's description of how Sess'nu races would get very old very quickly ... also, what is to prevent cunning sathar from biological alteration to look exactly like Sess'nu and start doing some serious infiltration? In my opinion (and it is only my opinion, mind you) the Sess'nu being accessible pc's could be pulled off if an involved and reasonable context/background/etc. to them was somehow added into the whole game setting in general. In other words, you would have to put the context for this in the pre-supposed background and make it clear to everyone that this addition is there. Perhaps another possibility is for a series of adventures to be done by the a group of players that initially centers around the Sess'nu and culminates in "solving the problems" of their being "accepted in the society of the other races". Then in the NEXT adventure/campaign/whatever you could build on that. Both of the above examples show possible routes for the "believability" of the Sess'nu as could be used in a "local" game setting or adventure series - for it to be inserted into the rulebooks and standard settings, etc. that these forums are striving to draw up in my opinion either something similar would need to be done or if they were included in the book it would have to be mentioned that they are are only an optional race addition and going into the detail of some of the practical problems of introducing the race as available for the pc's, and perhaps giving examples like the few above as possible ways to bring them into play in a "believable" way. Just "plunking them" into the ruleset as an possible race players might use for their PC's would (and did, at least amongst my fellow gamers back then) create difficulties such as IL gave examples of! @}-,-`- "It is a joyful thing indeed to hold intimate converse with a man after one’s own heart, chatting without reserve about things of interest or the fleeting topics of the world; but such, alas, are few and far between." – Yoshida Kenko (1283-1350), [i]Tsurezure-Gusa (1340) |
October 19, 2009 - 10:44am | building on mycanid's ideas- a series of adventures where the PC's encounter and over come the urge to kill a sessu out right then pick up one as tag along on thier ship could have some interesting consequences- Oh, I don't know maybe being wanted by Star Law as sathar collaborators because no one else knows that this is a sessu and all warm and fuzzy and friendly. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 February 28, 2012 - 4:42am | I know this is an old thread, but I thought it would be informative to let anyone who is interested, I have found the origin of the Sathar. I went to Google and put in Sathar and came up with this: http://www.popcouncil.org/staff/ZebaSathar.asp. Now before you go to the link, think of this. Here is a woman named Zeba, Zeb's Guide?; last name Sathar, Hmmm????; and she is on a population counscil, studing human populations, Hmmmmm??? Seems suspicious to me.  Anyway, Just a little fun. |
February 28, 2012 - 5:38am | Could she be an agent? OMG! THEY'RE AMONG US! I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 September 16, 2017 - 3:57pm | Revisting old threads to try and figure out where I got certain ideas from and refresh my mind on ideas for Sathar, I forgot how good this thread was and chalk full of ideas. I think I would have more clans though. "Never fire a laser at a mirror." |
 September 18, 2017 - 2:55pm | I am thinking there are more than two clans in Sathar space. Clan X is the predominant clan neer the Frontier border. Clan Y are discraced and see the Frontier as a possible way to regain status. Other clans are found deeper in Sathar space. It is a big galaxy and Star Frontiers has covered only a very tiny portion of it. There are no good Sathar. Sathar psycology does not permit such a thing. They are simply not made that way. Add to this the rigid conditioning, hypnosis, and a society that makes Stalin's Russia look like a freedom loving paradies, and well...the Sathar do not work and play well with others. In my games the Sather will always remain ultimately unknowable, implacable enemies. They are schemers and plotters and view all life as either tools to be used or enemies to be destroyed. This includes other Sathar, at least for those of high enough caste to have some semblance of free will. |
September 18, 2017 - 4:02pm | I am thinking there are more than two clans in Sathar space. Clan X is the predominant clan neer the Frontier border. Clan Y are discraced and see the Frontier as a possible way to regain status. Other clans are found deeper in Sathar space. It is a big galaxy and Star Frontiers has covered only a very tiny portion of it. There are no good Sathar. Sathar psycology does not permit such a thing. They are simply not made that way. Add to this the rigid conditioning, hypnosis, and a society that makes Stalin's Russia look like a freedom loving paradies, and well...the Sathar do not work and play well with others. In my games the Sather will always remain ultimately unknowable, implacable enemies. They are schemers and plotters and view all life as either tools to be used or enemies to be destroyed. This includes other Sathar, at least for those of high enough caste to have some semblance of free will. The only good sathar is a dead sathar. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
