The Exoskeleton

Georgie's picture
Georgie
February 21, 2010 - 8:03pm
Check it out! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1CeBOWm67A
 and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ_qR8zCLDc
Also, a story here about development of a fuel cell that will last for days of use. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/22/hulc_protonex_fuel_cell/

Could lead to a redefinition of the SF Exoskeleton. I would have killed for one of these during my stint in the infantry.
The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.    * Attributed to Mahatma Gandhi
Comments:

w00t's picture
w00t
February 21, 2010 - 9:07pm
V'inkett  m`vrak speaking to military contractors from Wartech Industries.

"Exoskeleton technology is considered part of the robotics field. If you want to think of them as wearable robots that’s pretty accurate, they sense what the user wants to do, where the user wants to go and then makes the motion."

  • Imagine an exo/robot that provides verbal tactical data during combat, complete with HUD displays.
  • Now imagine that same robot effected by an EMP.
  • And again imagine said robots brain hacked into by the enemy geek squad, "I'm sorry I cannot comply with your request, would you like some pudding?"

jedion357's picture
jedion357
February 21, 2010 - 11:22pm
if its robot tech what level of bot? 1 or 2 certianly not 3 since 3 has verbal communication.
I'd go 1 and much like air craft in WW1 I'd expect this to under go fast development where the machine goes drawing board to deployment in months to meet changing conditions

exoskeleton adds incredible ammounts of fire power to the infantry man but the man is the weak link so we need to protect him so you get an arms race ending with power armor and then robotic avatars that a soldier would "jack" into via an non jammable subspace carrier wave and control much like a video game in VR- game over? NP just reboot into another suit.

Adventure Idea- the 3rd sathar war and the worms are swarming an industrial planet. and the causalties are mounting and the local army/militia is strapped to replace trained troops. but the latest generation of combat armor is about to come of the line of one of the few remaining robotic factories so they'll have combat armor in job lots but not operators. The thing is this armor is not worn but jacked into in VR. the answer: gamers. They draft gamers with neural implants to leverage their gamins skills and throw them into the front lines so to speak. a PC could be even in a wheel chair (yes like the movie Avatar) but each gamer runs a squad and just reboots to a new member of the squad when his "ride" is KOed. Armor is mass produced and is thrown into the fight whole sale. Can the gaming geeks save the world?
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

w00t's picture
w00t
February 21, 2010 - 11:47pm
I imagine different types of exo's to suit the needs of different sectors;
  • Labor - this rig is used for pure strength but lacks in reaction speed. It's commonly used for lifting, pushing and carrying heavy loads. Typically used in warehouses or on planet with high gravity. +20 STR, -10 RS, increase hourly travel rate by x2
  • Explorer - this rig is popular among individuals and companies that explore the vast unknown - the uncharted areas of planetside frontier life. +10 STR, +10 RS, increase running movement by x1.5 and hourly travel rate by x2. Several types of gear is integrated into the suit such as a toxirad guage, chronochome, water packs and digital compass.
  • Soldier - this rig is designed to increase a soldiers endurance and reactions. It comes with many pockets and attachments to clip on SEU powerpacks. A trace-tag is integrated into the rig allowing the wearer to be tracked and identified as friend or foe.
  • Exo-Buddy - basically a solider exoskeleton that has a robot integrated into the frame. (still working out the details)

Sam's picture
Sam
February 22, 2010 - 12:47pm

I've thought of that too, Jedi. They are aware of what is going on in their virtual bodies, but not so around where their flesh and blood body remains. I've often thought of a strike team penetrating the lab defenses to discover the jacked in troops in rows. Of course, any worthwhile military force would ensure the jacked-in troopers would be alerted about security breeches ...

On exoskeletons, I've often thought they were one of the neatest and most under-explored bits of equipment -- seriously brought to light when that guy in Dark Side of the Moon waded into a party of adventurers (already greatly weakened in other combats) in hand-to-hand and dealt unbelievable damage with each hit (PS + MA +10) ... . Now every guy wants an exoskeleton and a anti-shock implant.


Gilbert's picture
Gilbert
February 22, 2010 - 3:44pm
  I have experimented with exoskeletons/body armor. I have narrowed it down to 4 classes of armor.
1) sentry armor: frontal armor is a carapace that mostly covers the front of the wearer and is east to get on and off in matter of minutes, less if experienced.
2) skirmisher/general labor (basic full armor): covers the wearer completely with ports for weapons attachments. This model can use some of the advanced equipment available to armor.
3) the combat/standard armor: most of the advanced equipment is based on this armor. It has ports of weapons and armored energy pods.
4) the battler/ general armor: this armor is the most used version of the battle armors by the military in front-line units. It is also the version that has all the advanced hardware designed for. It has attachable modules for any type of environment that a wearer may need to adapt for. It has advanced modules ranging from flight to submersible systems. It can have guided rockets to heavy weapons mounted onto it.
5) the war machine/ heavy industrial: This unit is mainly used in areas of extreme environments. Mining on asteroids is not beyond the use of these units. They have even become used in construction due to their capability to carry specialty modules of tools like welders, demo-packs, and extra limbs for maintaining holds on construction material like girders in buildings. These have begun to replace the work-pod on ships with there versatility that they offer.
  
  All of these units can also carry extra armor in places that my be vulnerable in certain environments. Screens are also available to them but some can only have one due to design criteria. Some of the more exotic applications to these units is a reasonably expensive spray on armor to add more protection to the wearer and the critical modules. A heavily armed unit can have up-to 12 weapons with some weapon selections adding even a wider range of firepower.

  The biggest limit to the factory units is that they can only be operated at extreme levels for around an hour at most. This can be extended by adding power pods to the units, however, they add weight to the units and are probably the most massive modules to add.

Georgie's picture
Georgie
February 22, 2010 - 6:54pm
Wow. I was thinking of re-aligning the AD Exo to be more along the lines of the HULC with the proposed fuel cell power source. It wouldn't impact character stats in any way, but would bear the character's equipment load making encumbrance nil even on high grav planets, and last for days.

But no. You guys go all Iron Man on me. I love it! Laughing

Carry on.
The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.    * Attributed to Mahatma Gandhi

w00t's picture
w00t
February 23, 2010 - 2:39pm
@Georgie, I'll try Innocent

Iron Man
- this rig is designed as a one man army.
  • Increase DEX +20
  • Increase RS +30
  • Increase STR +30
  • Integrated power backup holds 500 SEU
  • Integrated laser pistol in each hand
  • One hand is equipped with wrist rockets with auto-loader holding 9 rockets, #1-p1
  • Tactical computer identifies Friend from Foe, allows two weapons to be fired at once (no negative for using two weapons or off-hand)
  • Helmet has integrated toxi-rad, magnigoggles, chronochome, gas mask, poly-vox, digital compass and all-around-vision.
  • Integrated jump boots will propel a character 20 meters and include four charges, #1-p4
  • Computer link between suits allows information to be shared including target data, all-around-vision, medical information, etc.
  • Medical trace-tag records information such as heart rate, blood pressure, body temperature, blood oxygen level, etc. #3-p20
  • Medical kit includes 5 biocort doses and 2 staydose injections.
  • Integrated freeze field
  • All damage (interia, sonic, beam, electrical) is reduced by 1/2 (*). Stun and needler effects are ignored by the rig.
  • Integrated screens, only one can be used at a time. 
  • Punching damage 3d10
  • Falling damage is reduced by 1/4
  • Integrate two rifles or one heavy weapon (Player's choice)


Mass Damage (*)
If a character or vehicle takes a number of points of damage in one turn equal or greater to the STA value, this is considered mass damage. When this happens, the player must roll d100 and make a critical success in order to be relivable or stop explosion.


** Not sure if this is well thought out... just having some fun. :-P

Sam's picture
Sam
February 24, 2010 - 8:35am
Don't forget that one Dragon article had a powered armor suit. Perhaps overpowered to some, but it was a good first example for it in SF... available here (along with all sorts of other SF articles from Dragon...)

http://www.starfrontiers.com/rules/Dragon/listing.htm

Rum Rogue's picture
Rum Rogue
February 24, 2010 - 8:56am
Sam wrote:
Don't forget that one Dragon article had a powered armor suit. Perhaps overpowered to some, but it was a good first example for it in SF... available here (along with all sorts of other SF articles from Dragon...)

http://www.starfrontiers.com/rules/Dragon/listing.htm


Yeah, I thought it was a neat article at the time.  Powered armor was treated as a vehicle. I made several and pitted them against eachother to see how well it worked.  It was a fun process; especially when combined with the Tanks A Lot articles.
A character of mine ended up with one in a compaign.  Since it was the only one, it threw things off a bit. Even lightly armed I could literally wade through the opposition.  The gm never brought in an enemy powered armour.
The only thing that character had to fear (in PA) was facing more than one combat capable vehicle in a single fight.

But the exoskeleton should be somewhere between the powered armor and the unarmored meat-bags.  A couple-three-four armored exo's should be able to take out a power armor in a straight up fight, but one or two can do it with the right tactics and cover but still at great risk.
Same thing goes with exo's vs meat-bags.
The armored exoskeleton will greatly increase the troops survivability on the battlefield, but it shouldnt make him indestructable.
Time flies when your having rum.

Im a government employee, I dont goof-off. I constructively abuse my time.

SmootRK's picture
SmootRK
February 26, 2010 - 8:13am
I like the ExoSuit from Aliens (2)... like a fork-lift that you wear... doubles as a Alien Queen Basher.  Variations on this theme could include minor space maneuverability (like a big jet pack), a variety of power/vibro/laser saws or equipment for clearing tree-like growth quickly, or submersable varieties to give substantial protection and strength while underwater (where pressure is a factor).
<insert witty comment here>

w00t's picture
w00t
February 26, 2010 - 9:19am
SmootRK wrote:
I like the ExoSuit from Aliens (2)... like a fork-lift that you wear... doubles as a Alien Queen Basher.  Variations on this theme could include minor space maneuverability (like a big jet pack), a variety of power/vibro/laser saws or equipment for clearing tree-like growth quickly, or submersable varieties to give substantial protection and strength while underwater (where pressure is a factor).


I didn't physically describe the rigs but when I made this one I envisioned exactly that! :-)

Labor Exoskeleton - this rig is used for pure strength but lacks in reaction speed. It's commonly used for lifting, pushing and carrying heavy loads. Typically used in warehouses or on planet with high gravity. +20 STR, -10 RS, increase hourly travel rate by x2

We've had a lot of power armor articles, maybe I should make an exo article for the webzine?
Undecided



ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 26, 2010 - 9:32am
I am digging a few out my old notes, gotta update em, think I'll submit my first article.
Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

SmootRK's picture
SmootRK
February 26, 2010 - 11:49am
I think a big rig like the one in Aliens would give much more than +20 STR; perhaps just having a flat 150 STR rating and having even more substantial DEX/RS reductions, but I could imagine smaller varieties (such as the one the US Army is testing) being more of an enhancing sort of suit granting the stats you mention.... but that is just my thoughts on it.
<insert witty comment here>

ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 26, 2010 - 1:08pm
I've alwats like the look of this suit, YouTube - Japanese robotic ExoSkeleton. If they keep going, they'll have a exo suit that will be the ultimate combat terror.
Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 26, 2010 - 1:08pm
I've always like the look of this suit, YouTube - Japanese robotic ExoSkeleton. If they keep going, they'll have a exo suit that will be the ultimate combat terror.
Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

w00t's picture
w00t
February 26, 2010 - 1:46pm
Ripley seemed stressed and grunted a few times from the exertion - that's why I imagine exoskeletons boosting stats (or giving negatives). I guess one could argue that the power loader was a vehicle - not a true exo.

This is what I envision an exo to be/look like; exoskeletons amplifying and/or accelerating a character. They attach to limbs, etc.

exo

Ascent's picture
Ascent
February 26, 2010 - 3:19pm
They're going to have to armor that stuff for it to maintain viability, as I have no doubt may will be damaged, thus whole armor suits will have to be developed to account for it. You watch. And with the load-carrying capability even without power, armor shouldn't be a problem.
View my profile for a list of articles I have written, am writing, will write.
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"That guy's wise." —Logray, Star Wars Ep.VI: Return of the Jedi
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ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 26, 2010 - 5:11pm
 The loaders from aliens are basically forklifts on legs, they have basic computers to just keep it stable. It works by the pilot first moving, then it moves, so yeah its gonna tire you out.You can see Ripley picks her foot up a few cm off the foot rest to get the leg to move. thats how I see it.
  The japanese suit pictured above is cutting edge, it actually has a track record of moving before the wear does. and it looks cooler then the american one. If the loaders had that kinda system then Ripley wouldn't have struggle that much. I think they just wanted to hint at a possibility of a bigger machine to come if Cameron did another film.
Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

Georgie's picture
Georgie
February 26, 2010 - 6:25pm
ArtMic wrote:
The japanese suit pictured above is cutting edge, it actually has a track record of moving before the wear does. and it looks cooler then the american one.
Speaking from a tactical point of view, I prefer the HULC to the one w00t pictured. Yes, the Japanese one looks cooler, but it is also bulkier. When I'm moving tactically, I don't want stuff sticking out here, there, and everywhere. It's more stuff to snag on trees, vines, door/window jambs, and what have you. Mind you, I'm not saying the HULC style exo won't snag stuff, but it's more compact size and close fit will make less likely. In combat I don't want stuff that looks good, I want stuff that works and doesn't get in my way.
The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong.    * Attributed to Mahatma Gandhi

w00t's picture
w00t
February 26, 2010 - 7:15pm
Georgie you surprise me - you don't want blue lights outlining your body during a night raid?

Sheesh...

Foot in mouth

Gullwind's picture
Gullwind
February 26, 2010 - 7:26pm
I honestly don't remember where I got it, but someone did make up a Alien2 exo load-lifter. Its called the Heavy Materials Handler Human Physical Analogue Tool ("Hump-it"). The descreiption is kind of vague, other than multiplying the Strength by 15 and having a duration of 12 hours, there isn't much game information.
"Rome didn't build an empire by having meetings. They did it by killing those who stood in their way."

ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 26, 2010 - 8:33pm
True Georgi, I see your point. But the one pictured is aimed for the public, typically nurses and dock workers. I want to see what they have been cooking up for the military! If any nation knows the importance of moving stealthy and look cool doing it, its the japs. I can just see a army ranger showing off with his frame at a UN base camp, and a japanese soldier shows up and has a hard suit looking like it just walked out of Bubblegum Crisis.

 When my cuosiin was stationed in Japan in 88, he use to hang out with a bunch of Japanese students, one was a engineering major who had a dream of being the first guy to have a real Mecha inspired Hard suit. My cousin said he had some parts made and it was "freaking awsome". So I can just imagined if this guy stayed true to his dreams that we just might see Mecha soon. 

Hell they are in love with mechas in japan, they still have the life size gundam standing, and it was suppose to be a 3 month display.
Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

Will's picture
Will
February 27, 2010 - 7:43am
w00t wrote:
Georgie you surprise me - you don't want blue lights outlining your body during a night raid?

Sheesh...

Foot in mouth

Blue lights on combat armor...to be immediately followed by neon signs letting the bad guys know "I'M OVER HERE! SHOOT ME!"

The rest of his squad mates will have neon signs saying, "I'M WITH STUPID! SHOOT ME!"

"You're everything that's base in humanity," Cochrane continued. "Drawing up strict, senseless rules for the sole reason of putting you at the top and excluding anyone you say doesn't belong or fit in, for no other reason than just because you say so."


—Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stephens, Federation

Will's picture
Will
February 27, 2010 - 7:52am
Georgie wrote:
ArtMic wrote:
The japanese suit pictured above is cutting edge, it actually has a track record of moving before the wear does. and it looks cooler then the american one.
Speaking from a tactical point of view, I prefer the HULC to the one w00t pictured. Yes, the Japanese one looks cooler, but it is also bulkier. When I'm moving tactically, I don't want stuff sticking out here, there, and everywhere. It's more stuff to snag on trees, vines, door/window jambs, and what have you. Mind you, I'm not saying the HULC style exo won't snag stuff, but it's more compact size and close fit will make less likely. In combat I don't want stuff that looks good, I want stuff that works and doesn't get in my way.

In real life, however, you're only issued stuff that looks good and gets in your way.

"You're everything that's base in humanity," Cochrane continued. "Drawing up strict, senseless rules for the sole reason of putting you at the top and excluding anyone you say doesn't belong or fit in, for no other reason than just because you say so."


—Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stephens, Federation

w00t's picture
w00t
February 27, 2010 - 10:47am
Will wrote:
w00t wrote:
Georgie you surprise me - you don't want blue lights outlining your body during a night raid?

Sheesh...

Foot in mouth

Blue lights on combat armor...to be immediately followed by neon signs letting the bad guys know "I'M OVER HERE! SHOOT ME!"

The rest of his squad mates will have neon signs saying, "I'M WITH STUPID! SHOOT ME!"


HAHAHAHA ! Laughing
I would make a robot wear the exo. lol

Anyone ever wonder about how smart it was to use a light saber in the pitch of battle... "I am a Jedi, Can't touch this, Da Na Na Na"

ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 27, 2010 - 1:22pm
 Who all is working on a rule write up for Exo Suits/Mecha? 
 Cause I have a outline and old rules I use to use back in the day. While I've been working  on a article, I've notice that I have to dust these rules off and update them in order for the article could be up to date.
  Cause not to be greedy, but I am heavily into Mecha and the likes, and would like to head up that project.

Btw the article should be done as soon as monday.

Art


Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

w00t's picture
w00t
February 27, 2010 - 3:47pm
ArtMic wrote:
 Who all is working on a rule write up for Exo Suits/Mecha?


You. :-)
Your welcome to post your ideas for discussion here or create a specific topic.
I might add an article down the road...

I like Mech's myself but not sure where they fit into the Star Frontiers universe. No doubt they can be incorporated somewhere. :-)

ArtMic's picture
ArtMic
February 27, 2010 - 4:29pm
 Cool, I would like to thank the Satha...I mean Yeah I can do this hehehehehe.

 Mecha, exo suits, Robotics, Computers, all go hand in hand.

 I really can't see where they can't fit into it. They can be used everywhere, I am not a fan to the "have to fit a role" approach. Mecha n space ships some times are the same thing. 

 Who here hasn't have a nightmare where the dralasites got feed up with everyones lack of humor and built a fleet of transforming Clown cars that would turn into giant clowns and could come together and form the Mega Clown with seltzer firing cannons and Pie flinging action! muhahahahahahaha

 I look foward to pitching in my 2 credits worth hehehe.

Art
Gold is for the mistress-silver for the maid-copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.But Iron-Cold Iron- is master of them all

Will's picture
Will
February 27, 2010 - 5:10pm
ArtMic wrote:
 Cool, I would like to thank the Satha...I mean Yeah I can do this hehehehehe.

 Mecha, exo suits, Robotics, Computers, all go hand in hand.

 I really can't see where they can't fit into it. They can be used everywhere, I am not a fan to the "have to fit a role" approach. Mecha n space ships some times are the same thing. 

 Who here hasn't have a nightmare where the dralasites got feed up with everyones lack of humor and built a fleet of transforming Clown cars that would turn into giant clowns and could come together and form the Mega Clown with seltzer firing cannons and Pie flinging action! muhahahahahahaha

 I look foward to pitching in my 2 credits worth hehehe.

Art

Hence, the movie Killer Klowns From Outer Space.

"You're everything that's base in humanity," Cochrane continued. "Drawing up strict, senseless rules for the sole reason of putting you at the top and excluding anyone you say doesn't belong or fit in, for no other reason than just because you say so."


—Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stephens, Federation

Gullwind's picture
Gullwind
February 27, 2010 - 5:18pm
Shortly after I got into SF, I got some of the Robotech models, and came up with the idea of a campaign set around Laco's War (the PGC vs. Streel conflict) using 'mechs. The characters would have started out working on a recovery vehicle and moving up to piloting the "mechs themselves. Never got past that point, unfortunately, but it seemed like a neat idea at the time.
"Rome didn't build an empire by having meetings. They did it by killing those who stood in their way."