What will it take to fix the TimeLine?

jedion357's picture
jedion357
May 26, 2009 - 1:47pm
I'm working on this for my own games but the back and forth here on the forums helps me to find things I've over looked:

So since the Zebs timeline doesn't seem to fit the implied/suggested history of the modules
1. What would it take to fix it?
2. what are the key inconsistencies?
3. In fixing the timeline should we address the origins of species ie. the core four and where their homeworlds are.

Personally, for just running AD and ignoring ZEbs you can ignore the timeline after the Blue Plague entries and delete the contact with the Cappellan merchants as being a latter event. I like the idea that with the founding of the UPF and the stopping of the Blue Plague a period of adventure and exploration is set off for 20-30 years as people feel more secure and confident.

entries on Zebulon/Volturnus have to be adjusted if you're to keep the Volturnus series of modules.

if you worry about the origin of species then you need to tinker with the beginning of the timeline.

EDIT: maybe we could let it ride that Volturnus's discovery and hence the modules are prior to the founding of the UPF and wrap up the Battle of Volturnus with some eorna fighters pulled from cold storage and manned by PCs and Mechanons- it works but I dont like it.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!
Comments:

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
May 26, 2009 - 6:16pm
"What will it take to fix the TimeLine?"

Ignoring it completely and penning your own. I loosely based mine off the Zeb writings but altered it (mostly by shortening it) to fit my interpretation of the Frontier.

My biggest gripe was one set of characters could not possibly participate in all of the modules and plotlines without dying of old age. See, I personally didn't like the idea that it took 140+ years between the discovery of Zebulon and the second sathar war (with the first war occurring between those two events). The Volturnus adventure definitely had a post Sathar War 1 feel to it and in no way should precede it. Even though "UPF" is never mentioned in the adventure (re: Truane's Star battle fleet), characters are already familair with the Sathar so it's definitely a post SW1/UPF formation adventure.
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

Imperial Lord's picture
Imperial Lord
May 26, 2009 - 8:21pm
I have to agree with Shadow here.

It is a flaw in the game.  Rather than get specific, I would pick very basic "signposts" in the timeline, make it about a 1/3rd of a page long (and in large font print) and tell the Referee in that very section: 

"Sorry bud, but you have some work to do.  Trust us: it's not that bad to do your own, it's actually quite fun, and most of the questions answer themselves once you get your own timeline going.  Now stop reading this and get to work!"  For some sample timelines go to www.SFsampletls.whatever.com and see what some people have.

Then all you timeline people can show off...  LOL

The "signposts" would be the most basic information: meeting of the other races, foundation of the UPF, SW 1, maybe some years for the modules, start of SW2, and then Zebs stuff as an optional add-on.  That would be about it.

Then maybe provide some sample "salad bar" kind of stuff as suggestions.  Plus some advice on having your timeline MAKE SENSE. 

jedion357's picture
jedion357
May 26, 2009 - 10:12pm
I had pretty much planned to force the modules to fit a brief time period though I had not planned to play every one.

I've been pondering the whole timeline thing for my campaign in conjunction with an adventure idea- PCs find and board a derelict ship. the Navigation files ONLY contain certain jump routs to certain planets.
This is a clue to the age of the ship- figure out which system was the most recently discovered in terms of whats in the Nav computer and you have a rough date for the age of the ship.


I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

pineappleleader's picture
pineappleleader
May 27, 2009 - 7:23am
Imperial Lord wrote:
I have to agree with Shadow here.

It is a flaw in the game.  Rather than get specific, I would pick very basic "signposts" in the timeline, make it about a 1/3rd of a page long (and in large font print) and tell the Referee in that very section: 

"Sorry bud, but you have some work to do.  Trust us: it's not that bad to do your own, it's actually quite fun, and most of the questions answer themselves once you get your own timeline going.  Now stop reading this and get to work!"  For some sample timelines go to www.SFsampletls.whatever.com and see what some people have.


This Link does not work: "server not found"

Imperial Lord's picture
Imperial Lord
May 27, 2009 - 11:19pm
Sorry, pineappleleader

The website was just imaginary...

pineappleleader's picture
pineappleleader
May 28, 2009 - 7:49am
Imperial Lord wrote:
Sorry, pineappleleader

The website was just imaginary...

I guess the jokes on me. Embarassed

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
May 28, 2009 - 7:00pm
Although I'd love to get whatever.com.  That would be a fun domain to have.  Right now it's just a parking page.
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Anonymous's picture
w00t (not verified)
May 28, 2009 - 8:39pm
TerlObar wrote:
Although I'd love to get whatever.com.  That would be a fun domain to have.  Right now it's just a parking page.


Whatever!


Foot in mouthFoot in mouthFoot in mouthFoot in mouthFoot in mouth

Will's picture
Will
May 29, 2009 - 1:04am
I have to agree with Shadow as well...junk most of the "official" timeline and roll your own.

"You're everything that's base in humanity," Cochrane continued. "Drawing up strict, senseless rules for the sole reason of putting you at the top and excluding anyone you say doesn't belong or fit in, for no other reason than just because you say so."


—Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stephens, Federation

Corvus's picture
Corvus
June 3, 2009 - 2:31pm
Will wrote:
I have to agree with Shadow as well...junk most of the "official" timeline and roll your own.


Smoke 'em if you got 'em.
If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe. -- Carl Sagan

Max_Writer's picture
Max_Writer
May 18, 2010 - 7:30am
Sorry to ressurect this old thread but yesterday I stumbled across an article in Dragon Magazine #98 called "The Volturnus Connection" with some ideas on the dates of the Volturnus timeline.  The article can be found here:

http://www.starfrontiers.com/rules/

Under the Dragon Magazine articles.  This is before Zebulon's guide (which didn't have a timeline I liked at all). I've been searching for an 'unofficial' timeline that wasn't from Zebulon's guide online but have not had any luck so far.

Ascent's picture
Ascent
May 18, 2010 - 4:13pm
You haven't had much luck finding anything better because the Zeb's timeline isn't actually broken. Everytime someone pursues redoing the timeline, they simply discover that Zeb's did it better than what they come up with.

The only legitimate argument I've found is the negative slant given to the Mechanon, which mildly contradicts their depiction in the Volturnus modules, but I was easily able to reconcile this myself, by developing a story arch in which the Mechanon are treated with prejudice, leading to them being treated like second class citizens, if citizens at all (as indicated by the Council of World's reluctance to admit them), and that Zeb's simply presents the propogandist viewpoint.

The objection to the Blue Plague story arch is almost an objection simply because nothing existed on it before the Zeb's timeline, but I found it easy to expound on. The only other objection that I can really understand is that the Timeline is so detailed, but as I pointed out with the Blue Plague, it is easily expanded. A timeline does not prevent one from adding their own storyline, but instead gives structure around which to build more unified storylines.

If anything, a simple nudging of dates is the best I could expect for improving the timeline.
View my profile for a list of articles I have written, am writing, will write.
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Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
May 18, 2010 - 4:12pm
Max Writer wrote:
Sorry to ressurect this old thread but yesterday I stumbled across an article in Dragon Magazine #98 called "The Volturnus Connection" with some ideas on the dates of the Volturnus timeline.  The article can be found here:

http://www.starfrontiers.com/rules/ 


Wow, that's actually very close to where I placed the Volturnus adventure in my timeline (I have it spanning FY:46-47).
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
May 18, 2010 - 4:16pm
Ascent wrote:
You haven't had much luck finding anything better because the Zeb's timeline isn't actually broken.


So you would agree that the Volturnus adventure should occur prior to the first sathar war? Keep in mind the worms had alreaedy been on Volturnus before Truane's Star began exploring it or before the Star Devils began exploiting it, and also keep in mind that the characters already have a basic knowledge of the sathar.

That's a hole big enough to contain a super nova!
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

Ascent's picture
Ascent
May 18, 2010 - 4:37pm

Let me get back to you on that. That's the first time I've come across that complaint that I recall. I'll have to investigate.

View my profile for a list of articles I have written, am writing, will write.
"It's yo' mama!" —Wicket W. Warrick, Star Wars Ep. VI: Return of the Jedi
"That guy's wise." —Logray, Star Wars Ep.VI: Return of the Jedi
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jedion357's picture
jedion357
May 18, 2010 - 9:01pm
The Devil Is in the Details.

Time line is very detailed in some areas but doesn't mentioned names and dates as to when the 4 plague planets were colonized/settled or by who- just totally left out- you could say that with the quarrentine that the government has done a information blackout which is why we dont get that information but thats a crock as 6 Billion beings don't suddenly forget the names of 4 planets. Its not even likely that the UPF managed to delete all astro records of the jump routes to those planets. So this is a problem that aught to be resolved if you want to use the Zebs timeline. (originally I liked the 4 planets for the home planets of the core four with the human planet being "New Earth" so named as the first planet colonized by humans after arriving in the Frontier. Not sure if I'm sweet on that idea anymore.

The massive gaping whole about Volturnus being discovered before the 1st Sathar War is a problem as it jams up the material from the module, contradicting it on several points. (I dont think that the time line should be allowed to blow the modules out of the water simply because you dont play the timeline you play the modules.)

The blow by blow for the 2nd sathar war- whats the heck was the thought be hind that? Tedious.

Finally the time line negelects after effects of key events ie, the volturnus campaign and it should have dealt with it. Whats the status of Volturnus in the Frontier, what role do the eorna play, the natives? the mega corps? and the UPF in this planet after 3 module campaign is completed.

There is a lot of little detials in the timeline that don't make a lot of sense when you start asking questions: How could the Frontier's most noted scientist discover Zebulon but fail to discover the other inhabitable planet in the system and it remained "undiscovered" for 4 years- was survey equipment not working? How notable was this professor that he totally missed an inhabitable planet?
Volturnus was settled immediately after its discovered? by who the Red devil?

If the Blue Plague is "erradicated" then why are 4 planets still quarrentined? and all those refugees still disposesed and left on that crap hole planet in the Devco system?

Why is the snollball system still a UPF secret- the memne are now our allies (they had ion engine powered ships of their own before the sathar)? Would not trade and exchange help them to get back on their feet faster?

For me you have to deal with the Plague issues, the inconsistencies in the timeline vs the modules, the after math of some of the modules, and the hand full of statements that just don't make sense when you think about them- then the time line will be usable- the detailled play by play of the 2nd sathar war is not that neccessary unless you're looking to recreate its battles.

EDIT: RE The dragon article "Volturnus Connection" this was favorite topic of mine- think we talked to death the ideas over in the "Why Jamison Cant be the Star Devil or could he?" thread; which was a fun discussion
Still I'm not 100% sure that dragon article should carry the weight of canonicity. (ooops did I just state a sacrilidge?)
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Imperial Lord's picture
Imperial Lord
May 18, 2010 - 10:05pm

The whole Zebs treatment of  SW2 is horrible.

That whole asteroid base thing and the attempts to negotiate by the Drals...  Ugh.  As if...




Anonymous's picture
w00t (not verified)
May 18, 2010 - 11:09pm
This will be one of the tasks we (those interested in a new steamlined rule set) need to tackle when crafting the Star Frontiers Setting Book for FrontierSpace core rules. Will we all agree? Probably not, but that's what Project Leads are for.

The outcome will be a professional, artistic pleasing book complete with the core-four race backgrounds, time-lines, more gear, fleshed out star systems, yada and more yada! I think I'd like mine in hard copy. :-)

Something else I thought of... what do we do with the AD/Zeb's split? Should Zeb's material be in a separate section of the book? Combined? Thrown out?
Undecided

-- don't answer that now please. Innocent




Ascent's picture
Ascent
May 19, 2010 - 4:35pm

jedion, some of what you suggest is covered by financial issues, such as not discovering the second planet in the Zebulon system for 4 years. Probes and expeditions cost money, and research grants aren't bottomless.

As for the quarantined planets, this may also be money related. Vaccines costs money, lots and lots of money. Those 4 planets may be quarantined as a sacrifice while the planets that can be handled reasonably are inocculated. Eventual attention could be given to those planets. In the meantime, the plague is working its course on those planets. Perhaps it even took a stronger hold on those planets. Maybe there is something there causing a resistence to the vaccine. There could be many reasons for such things. I see that as lots of ground for development rather than cutting off. At least one of those systems (I forget which one), was listed in the original rules, if I remember correctly. Alpha, I think. (Under a different name, of course).

For me, I assume Snoball is a UPF secret because it is on the edge of Sathar space, and too easy to attack, and therefore too costly to protect. Think of it from a governmental perspective.

I think the reason you suggest for the blow-by-blow on the Sathar wars is exactly right. It's a historical perspective. And besides, why wouldn't a timeline give thorough details on the most important events in Frontier history? To exclude such pivotal battles and assassination attempts would be to suggest that the Sathar war wasn't important to the Frontier. Again, like I mentioned above, no matter how thorough the timeline, there is plenty of room to add in your own stuff. It's not preemptive, it's a structure, that's all. My view is that anyone who feels restricted by such a timeline lacks imagination. I believe it was Dostoyevsky who said [paraphrase?]: 'creativity thrives under restriction'.


So if what is being said here regarding Volturnus is true, it's the only substantial problem, and sounds to me like it is easily fixed with a minor adjustment to the order of events in the timeline.

View my profile for a list of articles I have written, am writing, will write.
"It's yo' mama!" —Wicket W. Warrick, Star Wars Ep. VI: Return of the Jedi
"That guy's wise." —Logray, Star Wars Ep.VI: Return of the Jedi
Do You Wanna Date My Avatar? - Felicia Day (The Guild)

jedion357's picture
jedion357
May 19, 2010 - 7:18pm
Ascent wrote:

jedion, some of what you suggest is covered by financial issues, such as not discovering the second planet in the Zebulon system for 4 years. Probes and expeditions cost money, and research grants aren't bottomless.

Actually I was thinking of the standard KH equipment atmo-probes, you get 1/HS and can launch them from outside the system to seek out a specific planet. They are a great cost and time saving item as you can launch a half dozen or more form any reasonable size survey ship  With the habitable zone of a system being so narrow It seems sloppy that a "noted scientist" should miss a habitable world for lack of sending an atmo-probe. In fact the statement in SF-0 that says Volturnus was explored by Remote probe is probably a refference to the survey probes

 

Ascent wrote:
As for the quarantined planets, this may also be money related. Vaccines costs money, lots and lots of money. Those 4 planets may be quarantined as a sacrifice while the planets that can be handled reasonably are inocculated. Eventual attention could be given to those planets. In the meantime, the plague is working its course on those planets. Perhaps it even took a stronger hold on those planets. Maybe there is something there causing a resistence to the vaccine. There could be many reasons for such things. I see that as lots of ground for development rather than cutting off. At least one of those systems (I forget which one), was listed in the original rules, if I remember correctly. Alpha, I think. (Under a different name, of course).

I find it hard to believe that four planets would be written off- the outcry would be to great and synth corp or somebudy would step in providing vaccine and scoring a PR coup and recovering realestate, labor force, a market for future sales. Its not too expensive to pay for a vaccine its too expensive to not pay for the vaccine.

check you AD map for Alpha; its not there in the original Zebs map it was Alpha, Beta, Gamma, & Delta that turned up on the map as the plague systems with no prior name in the AD source; However the new digitally remastered zebs has no greek letter designations thus clouding the issue as effectively as a nebulae

 

Ascent wrote:
For me, I assume Snoball is a UPF secret because it is on the edge of Sathar space, and too easy to attack, and therefore too costly to protect. Think of it from a governmental perspective.

Again I dont see it playing that way but rather the enemy of my enemy is my friend and the comment in the material about Snowboll's jump route being a military secret probably stems from the fact that it was introduce in a 3 module series and they didn't want the inconsistency of players trying to take their ships their before the events of the modules transpire. So initially it would be a secret but that would not last. The new race would be brought more fully into the Frontier and UPF's sway and since they're starting form such a steep disadvantage, having been recently occupied by the sathar, the push will be on to get them to conform to UPF doctrine for a higher level of coordination, the mega corps will be knocking at their door to open up the new market

Ascent wrote:
My view is that anyone who feels restricted by such a timeline lacks imagination. I believe it was Dostoyevsky who said paraphrase? 'creativity thrives under restriction'. So if what is being said here regarding Volturnus is true, it's the only substantial problem, and sounds to me like it is easily fixed with a minor adjustment to the order of events in the timeline.

I realize that I'm among the ranks of the least imaginative and least creative around here... Tongue out
but I did attempt an over haul of the timeline but the more I dug in the more I discovered that the problem blossumed.

I wanted a cohessive timeline for my players but realized that I was wasting time on the timeline and figured I should just run the game. Which was what I did.

Personally I'd love to seen what your minor changes are to the time line to straighten out the inconsistencies.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

AZ_GAMER's picture
AZ_GAMER
May 19, 2010 - 7:34pm

From 1984 to 1990 when I was playing SF reguarly I never did use the Zeb timeline, as a matter of fact I only used Zebs' Guide as a resource book and never really liked it. I am starting to warm up to it now but still dont care for the feel it gave the game and all the table shifting was way too cumbersome. Mostly we played by largely house rules after mastering the AD and SFKH sets.


Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
May 19, 2010 - 9:38pm
Oh, here's another major OOPS moment in the Zeb timeline:

"Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space - page 53" wrote:
60 f.y. Rhianna system is discovered by the Cassidine Development Corporation but is kept secret.

63 f.y. Streel attacks CDC on Alcazzar. Star Law intervenes and averts a potential corporate war.


Now I've played and GMed the "Mission to Alcaazar" module several times each and have no recollection of anything being mentioned about Star Law. But let's disregard that bit about Star Law for a moment, here's where they really screwed the pooch. Flip back three pages to the "Planets of the Frontier" section and read the description for Alcazzar:

"Zebulon's Guide to Frontier Space - page 50" wrote:
Alcazzar (Rhianna) is unusual in that its equator is tilted 90 degrees to the plane of its orbit about Rhianna. This causes severe seasonal temperature variations. The northern and southern hemispheres alternate season of unlivable cold and heat. Only about the equator is habitation possible. Tremendous wind storms sweep Alcazzar's surface at all times. Only WarTech Inc. navigators know the star route to Rhianna.


Only WarTech, they say. So can someone PLEASE explain to me exactly how CDC discovered it and how did Streel attack them there when only WarTech navigators know the jump route?

Now I know that nobody play tested this before it was published, but did anyone bother to PROOF READ or EDIT it?!
Surprised Surprised Surprised
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

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jedion357's picture
jedion357
May 20, 2010 - 5:43am
I could be wrong but I also dont believe that the discription Shadow Quoted concerning alcazzar doesn't match the actual description in the module: IIRC the module just has the planet turning very slowly so that the native population migrates to stay in the effective "summer" and avoid the deadly winter.

Also of all the planets in the AD core setting White Light is discovered last after Volturnus has been colonized and settled. Call me crazy and a bit of a traditionalist but a Heavy population world with a monarch and the feeling of long traditions probably should have been settled 1st or 2nd by Humans just to give the monarchy time to mature and its traditions time to become settled

Also the order of discovery and colonization of the systems that Zebs give is impossible without other known jump routs that arn't there in the material:

If Theseus is 1st then Prengular is 2nd how did they get there? there would Have to be a 13lightyear jump between the 2 and its not on the map. the only way to get from Theseus to Prengular would be through Timeon (discovered 12th) or White Light (discovered 16th)

K'tsa Kar is discovered before Kaken Kar and White Light which are the only jump routes into it.
etc.

Fromeltar is left out altogether, no explanation why of all the system footnotes the one for Kisk-Kar is a colony controlled by the vrusk in Fromeltar.

In considering the discontinuities of the time lime One thing can now be resolved: where the frag Cygnus Omicron IX! make it the plague planet closest to Truane's star.

Whatever you do with the timeline, whether you take ascents approach and add the few minor changes, or you try to resolve the glarring inconsistencies you will have to re-write the map of the Frontier too

1. under Ascents approach you'll have to map in the jump routes that let people move around before the intervening systems were discovered and the routes for the plague planets too

2. with a rewrite of the timeline you still have to figure in the plague systems and their jump routes

Do we want a whole new map of the Frontier too as well as a "fixed" timeline?
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Inigo Montoya's picture
Inigo Montoya
May 20, 2010 - 6:08am
I think a whole new map would mess up too many peoples campaigns. Not to mention trying to forget the old map. I've never cared for the timeline and have largely just ignored it. Of course, my players are all under the age of 13 and we are using the KISS method of playing SF. And as an aside, I have found the amount of detail in the 2nd Sathar War annoying considering lack of information on planets and their cultures. It just seems to me that there were more important things to be long winded about that seemed to be overlooked. But that is just me. 

Max_Writer's picture
Max_Writer
May 20, 2010 - 8:21am
Shadow Shack wrote:
So you would agree that the Volturnus adventure should occur prior to the first sathar war? Keep in mind the worms had alreaedy been on Volturnus before Truane's Star began exploring it or before the Star Devils began exploiting it, and also keep in mind that the characters already have a basic knowledge of the sathar.
That's my main problem with the timeline - According to the front of the basic rule book, the first Sathar War is over and the UPF has been established. Cue Volturnus. Then the Second Sathar War. Rubbed me the wrong way when Zebulon's suddenly put the whole Crash on Volturnus scenario before the first Sathar War. Felt like bad retrofitting of the whole campaign.

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
May 20, 2010 - 10:57am
Personally, I never really like the Blue Plague and always threw it out for some of the same reasons others have objected to it here as well.  It just didn't seem to make sense to me.

So let's get to work on a revamp.  I've uploaded the original Zeb's guide timeline into the wiki on the Frontier Timeline page.  Jump over, log on and edit away.   Right now it is just the raw Zeb's Guide timeline.  Feel free to edit, re-arrange or delete to your hearts content.  It's a wiki, so all revisions can be rolled back if necessary and you can always see what others have changed and difference beween versions of the page.  You can create new pages to hold details about specific events and link them to the main page as well as pages to describe the various systems, races, etc mentioned in the timeline.

I also created a Frontier Timeline forum area on the Star Frontniers Network forums for discussions (of course they can always be discussed here as well.) of ideas or issues we come up with.
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jedion357's picture
jedion357
May 20, 2010 - 11:31am
I've come to the conclusion that making a new map is a bad idea and would be an uphill climb to get it in wide use so I think I have a solution for the blue plague problem

The 4 plague systems were never formally colonized and just held scientific outpost because these 4 systems had been discovered to hold some ancient ruins all from the same civilization but results were still inconclusive whether they could be attributed to the tetrachs. The blue plague originated on one of these as UPF scientist were probing and ancient energy source on one it sent out a tacyon signals then a vault open and released _____?_____, The scientist began to suffer ills and at least one team brought the blue plague back to the Frontier. The UPF has quarrentined all 4 planets and since the jump routes were already a guarded secret it was easy enough to prevent them from becoming public knowledge, No doubt PGC still has the astro records for those routes locked away (they're the mega corp specifically said to be involved in archaeology) but out of fear of what else lurks at these identical sites all four planets are off limits and the UPF will shoot any ship making contact with them and trying to lift off.

This leaves it in, explains the quarrentine and explains why all 4 systems in the AD map are listed as unexplored/uninhabitated, suddenly the greek letter designations make sense (the sites were discovered and largely kept secret so they could be studied and got simple names) and it causes the least amount of disruption to the cannon material since its just a twist on what is actually there.

It still explains the MSO's origin and

it creates some intriguing possibilities for adventure on plague planets- UPF research continues in the form of a science ship that launches life pods loaded with robot that have coms and maintain contact with the live controllers on the ship, who direct them around as they take a page form Bob Ballard and use remotes to explore the planet surface as they attempt to unravel the mysteries of the ruins.
maybe there is a tie in to the tetrarch ruins on Laco or maybe there isn't but either way its of high priority to figure out if there is and ascertain if their is a threat lurking burried in the ruins on Laco since it is now a settle world (Laco in AD had an outpost population but in Zebs it had jumped to moderat with industrial economy-presumably after the dislocations of the SW1 and after the corporate war fought there a more substantial population remained behind)

On 3 of the 4 planets there has yet to be nothing released from the secret vaults so it is possible to land and "tomb raid" the ruins without actually getting the plague its just that the UPF is waiting to blow you out of the sky on lift off unless you are a part of the special science team still investigating the planets.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

iggy's picture
iggy
May 20, 2010 - 1:33pm
Zebs Guide wrote:
17-27FY The Blue Plague sweeps the Frontier. Scientists believe it was brought to the Sundown system by an alien vessel that crashed on Starmist. Because of Starmist's light population, the plague was not immediately detected and had a chance to mutate. It is believed that vermin from the planet became infected and somehow gained entry to a ship. The ship makes several stops on the Frontier and the plague spreads rapidly.


I have long suspected this was to be a lead to a set of modules that placed the players or the guy who first found Starmist at fault for spreading the plague.  I however have problems with four whole planets being quarantined.  I do agree that the planets must have had light populations because they are new in Zeb's.  That so, why quarantine new colony planets when the population can be more easily accounted for.  If there was a quarantine it would be easy to lift after the vaccine is available.

I like Jedion's idea as a start for filling in the blanks.

As for the rest of the timeline, I too have had problems getting the discovery order to make sense.  I also have problems with the population sizes of the planets in relation to the timeline.  some are too lite others too heavy, but mostly, too heavy.
-iggy

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
May 20, 2010 - 2:20pm
jedion357 wrote:
Also of all the planets in the AD core setting White Light is discovered last after Volturnus has been colonized and settled. Call me crazy and a bit of a traditionalist but a Heavy population world with a monarch and the feeling of long traditions probably should have been settled 1st or 2nd by Humans just to give the monarchy time to mature and its traditions time to become settled


You're not crazy. Take a peek at my pf:100 game in Historic Adventures. As much as I tried to stick to the Zeb's timeline for that setting, I had to include White Light on the map. It just doesn't make sense to have that system be the last one to find. The Warriors of White Light module dispels that with King Leotus XX --- that's twenty generations of the ruling line, or roughly 500 years. And that's just for the current ruling line, not whoever might have been "in charge" before that.

And where are the jump routes to Theseus, which was allegedly discovered before White Light? Certainly not the route from New Streel, Streel (according to their own timeline) wasn't established until well after the UPF was founded. Did everyone suddenly forget the old route after White Light was discovered? Not likely, if anything the White Light/Theseus route would be new and in addition to whatever old routes existed if that was the case.


And I'll resubmit what I initially said in my first response here: the Zeb's timeline is arranged so that it is nearly impossible to have one set of player characters complete all the published modules (assuming they survive each one), they'll die of old age before they can complete the run according to the timeline.
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

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TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
May 20, 2010 - 3:31pm
Ohhhh.  Populations, fun.  Birth rates, death rates, children per family, oh my Smile

We had a discussion on this a few (=3) years back on the starfrontiers.org site.  Check out this discussion and the one linked to for ideas.

Basically, I worked up an example and some variations that showed you could get just about any population you wanted given the timespan of the Frontier and perfectly reasonable assumptions.  (I need to find that spreadsheet.)  What we need to do is decide what the various population classes mean in terms of numbers.
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